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Re: [Ecrit] LoST

Subject: Re: [Ecrit] LoST
From: Hannes Tschofenig
Date: Wed, 11 Jul 2007 10:55:27 +0200
Hi James,

Winterbottom, James wrote:
Hi Hannes,

That makes perfect sense.

The issue that I am most concerned about is the limitation in the shape
representation in the basic location profile. As it currently stands I
cannot use standard GPS related shapes, my end-point has to interpret
location and put into a profile. This is incompatible with a large
number of solutions deployed today on which many deployments will be
based, at least initially. I strongly urge this WG to reconsider this
restriction and include circle, and ellipse at a minimum.
Some time back we also discussed this issue and the conclusion was the following: * Let us build a mechanism in there to have a mechanism to extend the location shapes.
* Let us specify simple location shapes first.

I know that there is this limitation with geodetic shapes and a separate location profile would be needed to address GPS and the cellular world. On the cellular aspect we also had a discussion with the 3GPP. There they are currently not using LoST at the end point since they are focusing on a different architecture (see http://tools.ietf.org/html/draft-tschofenig-ecrit-architecture-overview-00). Even if they would use LoST at the end point they most likely want to hide the location information of the end point or to make use of information like cell ids (as recorded in the issue tracker a while ago: http://www.tschofenig.com:8080/lost/issue16).

Now, everything boils down to the question of GPS. Since GPS produces data in a format that is not PIDF-LO alike we can already assume that the end host has to understand the format. It can now encode it in different ways. In previous discussions a couple of us wanted to add a polygon as a location profile to the LoST document since it would also address the location hiding requirement. Since this issue came also up in the location hiding context we postpone this topic entirely.

Hence, it is up to us to come up with a location profile that supports
* a circle
* an ellipse
* a polygon,
* a combination of the above
* cell-ids
if we think there is a need todo so.

Ciao
Hannes

Cheers
James

-----Original Message-----
From: Hannes Tschofenig [mailto:Hannes.Tschofenig@xxxxxxx]
Sent: Wednesday, 11 July 2007 4:58 PM
To: Winterbottom, James
Cc: ECRIT
Subject: Re: [Ecrit] LoST

Hi James,

let me pick a concrete example: LoST server discovery.
Currently, we have specified the usage of DHCP and DNS. Only the
former
allows to discover the LoST server in the access network. I am,
however,
aware of the work on HELD discovery, see
http://tools.ietf.org/wg/geopriv/draft-thomson-geopriv-lis-discovery-
01.txt,
that aims to discover a HELD server in the access network using DNS
mechanisms.

Now, even though the current LoST draft does not describe how to
discover a LoST server using DNS in the access network that can be
extended later when the above document is generalized (which I think
would be a good idea).

Does that make sense to you?

Ciao
Hannes

Winterbottom, James wrote:
Hi Hannes,

What exactly do you mean by postponed?

Cheers
James





-----Original Message-----
From: Hannes Tschofenig [mailto:Hannes.Tschofenig@xxxxxxx]
Sent: Wednesday, 11 July 2007 5:58 AM
To: ECRIT
Subject: [Ecrit] LoST

Hi all,

during the WGLC we have received a number of comments. Then, we

delayed

the completion of the work because of the location hiding
discussions.
Now, you can find the latest version of the document at:


http://www.tschofenig.com/svn/draft-ietf-ecrit-lost/draft-ietf-ecrit-los
t-

06.txt

We have also updated the DHCP-based LoST discovery draft (based on
the
comments we received from the DHC working group). The document can
be
found here:


http://www.tschofenig.com/svn/draft-tschofenig-dhc-lost-discovery/draft-
ietf-ecrit-dhc-lost-discovery-02.txt

Now, here is the unfortunate news: It seems that we did not submit
the
LoST draft :-(
Everyone was assuming that someone else is going to submit it.

Ciao
Hannes

PS: James has recently sent a number of comments. Some of them got
reflected in the document (namely the editorial onces). Others got
intentionally postponed since we discussed them already in the
past.
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